Mercurial > hg > rsof

comparison fmh_2009-01-05.html @ 4:5d008bcf61d4

Find changesets by keywords (author, files, the commit message), revision number or hash, or revset expression.
real html
author ht
date Mon, 05 Jan 2009 16:51:38 -0500
parents 95b3855d61d7
children 9d70132b8833
comparison
equal deleted inserted replaced
3:95b3855d61d7 4:5d008bcf61d4
1 <?xml version="1.0" encoding="utf-8"?> 1 <?xml version="1.0" encoding="utf-8"?>
2 <!DOCTYPE html 2 <!DOCTYPE html PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD XHTML 1.0 Strict//EN"
3 PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD XHTML 1.0 Strict//EN" "http://www.w3.org/TR/xhtml1/DTD/xhtml1-strict.dtd"> 3 "http://www.w3.org/TR/xhtml1/DTD/xhtml1-strict.dtd">
4 <html xmlns="http://www.w3.org/1999/xhtml"><head><meta name="copyright" content="Copyright (C) 2007 Henry S. Thompson"/><meta http-equiv="Content-type" content="text/html; charset=utf-8"/><style type="text/css"> 4 <html xmlns="http://www.w3.org/1999/xhtml">
5 pre.code {font-family: monospace} 5 <head>
6 pre {margin-left: 0em} 6 <meta name="copyright"
7 ul.nolabel { margin: 0; margin-left: -2.5em} 7 content="Copyright (C) 2007 Henry S. Thompson" />
8 ul.naked li { list-style-type: none } 8 <meta http-equiv="Content-type"
9 ol ol {list-style-type: lower-alpha} 9 content="text/html; charset=utf-8" />
10 .math {font-family: 'Arial Unicode MS', 'Lucida Sans Unicode', serif} 10 <style type="text/css">pre.code {font-family: monospace} pre
11 .sub {font-size: 80%; vertical-align: sub} 11 {margin-left: 0em} ul.nolabel { margin: 0; margin-left: -2.5em}
12 .termref {text-decoration: none; color: #606000} 12 ul.naked li { list-style-type: none } ol ol {list-style-type:
13 div.toc h2 {font-size: 120%; margin-top: 0em; margin-bottom: 0em} 13 lower-alpha} .math {font-family: 'Arial Unicode MS', 'Lucida Sans
14 div.toc h4 {font-size: 100%; margin-top: 0em; margin-bottom: 0em; 14 Unicode', serif} .sub {font-size: 80%; vertical-align: sub}
15 margin-left: 1em} 15 .termref {text-decoration: none; color: #606000} div.toc h2
16 div.toc h1 {font-size: 140%; margin-bottom: 0em} 16 {font-size: 120%; margin-top: 0em; margin-bottom: 0em} div.toc h4
17 div.toc ul {margin-top: 1ex} 17 {font-size: 100%; margin-top: 0em; margin-bottom: 0em; margin-left:
18 .byline {font-size: 120%} 18 1em} div.toc h1 {font-size: 140%; margin-bottom: 0em} div.toc ul
19 div.figure {margin-left: 2em} 19 {margin-top: 1ex} .byline {font-size: 120%} div.figure
20 div.caption {font-style: italic; font-weight: bold} 20 {margin-left: 2em} div.caption {font-style: italic; font-weight:
21 </style><title>Future of 7 VT working group: First meeting</title></head><body style="font-family: DejaVu Sans, Arial; background: rgb(254,250,246); font-size: 12pt; width: 20cm; align: center; margin-left: auto; margin-right: auto"> 21 bold}</style>
22 <div style="text-align: center"> 22 <title>Future of 7 VT working group: First meeting</title>
23 <h1>Future of 7 VT working group: First meeting</h1> 23 </head>
24 <div class="byline">This informal summary by Henry S. Thompson, Convenor</div> 24 <body style="font-family: DejaVu Sans, Arial; background: rgb(254,250,246); font-size: 12pt; width: 20cm; align: center; margin-left: auto; margin-right: auto">
25 <div class="byline">Held at 7 Victoria Terrace, Edinburgh on 5 January 2009, 7:30 p.m.</div> 25
26 </div> 26 <div style="text-align: center">
27 27 <h1>Future of 7 VT working group: First meeting</h1>
28 <div> 28 <div class="byline">This informal summary by Henry S. Thompson,
29 <h2>1. Attendance</h2> 29 Convenor</div>
30 <p>Present: Alison Burnley, Alastair Cameron, Madeleine Harding, Phil Lucas, Brian Mayes, Laurie Naumann, Rufus Reade, 30 <div class="byline">Held at 7 Victoria Terrace, Edinburgh on 5
31 Eileen Schott, Don Stubbings, Henry Thompson (in the clerk's chair)</p> 31 January 2009, 7:30 p.m.</div>
32 </div> 32 </div>
33 <div> 33 <div>
34 <h2>2. Introductions</h2> 34 <h2>1. Attendance</h2>
35 <p>The members of the working group gave brief self-introductions</p> 35 <p>Present: Alison Burnley, Alastair Cameron, Madeleine Harding,
36 </div> 36 Phil Lucas, Brian Mayes, Laurie Naumann, Rufus Reade, Eileen
37 <div> 37 Schott, Don Stubbings, Henry Thompson (in the clerk's chair)</p>
38 <h2>3. Background</h2> 38 </div>
39 <p>Alastair Cameron, on behalf of Area Meeting gave us 39 <div>
40 some background:</p> 40 <h2>2. Introductions</h2>
41 <ul> 41 <p>The members of the working group gave brief
42 <li>What is our vision for what Quakers need as a physical presence in Edinburgh?</li> 42 self-introductions</p>
43 <li>This includes the possibility of not having a large central building 43 </div>
44 of any kind. It's assumed that this would lead to a reduction in expenditure 44 <div>
45 and effort.</li> 45 <h2>3. Background</h2>
46 <li>AM looking for renewal of its sense of what its presence in Edinburgh 46 <p>Alastair Cameron, on behalf of Area Meeting gave us some
47 should be</li> 47 background:</p>
48 <li>We are on the cusp of a number of substantial items of expenditure, 48 <ul>
49 which are perhaps a bit difficult to motivate without a clear underlying vision.</li> 49 <li>What is our vision for what Quakers need as a physical presence
50 </ul> 50 in Edinburgh?</li>
51 <p>Don Stubbings, who was 51 <li>This includes the possibility of not having a large central
52 instrumental in raising some of the questions we will be considering:</p> 52 building of any kind. It's assumed that this would lead to a
53 <ul> 53 reduction in expenditure and effort.</li>
54 <li>Don has served for many years on Fabric and Maintenance</li> 54 <li>AM looking for renewal of its sense of what its presence in
55 <li>Costs coming: 55 Edinburgh should be</li>
56 <ul> 56 <li>We are on the cusp of a number of substantial items of
57 <li>Toilets need renewed</li> 57 expenditure, which are perhaps a bit difficult to motivate without
58 <li>Heating is a problem</li> 58 a clear underlying vision.</li>
59 <li>The flats are an ongoing financial drain</li> 59 </ul>
60 <li>The kitchen is scheduled for a refit</li> 60 <p>Don Stubbings, who was instrumental in raising some of the
61 <li>The roof is being refurbished, and is involving more and costing 61 questions we will be considering:</p>
62 more than expected, taking up most of our cash reserves</li> 62 <ul>
63 <li>Children's space restructuring? Interacts with the kitchen refit.</li> 63 <li>Don has served for many years on Fabric and Maintenance</li>
64 </ul> 64 <li>Costs coming:
65 </li> 65 <ul>
66 </ul> 66 <li>Toilets need renewed</li>
67 <p>The above might add up to 200K GBP over the next few years. The expense 67 <li>Heating is a problem</li>
68 of the roof repairs stimulated a consideration of whether we should be 68 <li>The flats are an ongoing financial drain</li>
69 more-or-less uncritically committing to maintaining an old building which will 69 <li>The kitchen is scheduled for a refit</li>
70 likely continue to require substantial investment. This eventually led to a 70 <li>The roof is being refurbished, and is involving more and
71 presentation to AM in August. In the twenty years since we purchased 7VT, no 71 costing more than expected, taking up most of our cash
72 overall review of our use of the premises has been undertaken.</p> 72 reserves</li>
73 <p>Our circumstances have changed in many ways over that time, including 73 <li>Children's space restructuring? Interacts with the kitchen
74 changes in external regulation: Child Protection, Health and Safety, Food 74 refit.</li>
75 Sanitation. The rental of our premises has also evolved, alongside an increase 75 </ul></li>
76 in the number of other churches etc. who make premises available. The issue of 76 </ul>
77 balance between income generated and operating costs, given our commitment to 77 <p>The above might add up to 200K GBP over the next few years. The
78 charging very low rents for Quaker groups/other groups with certain specified qualities.</p> 78 expense of the roof repairs stimulated a consideration of whether
79 <p>At the same time, the awareness of many Quaker users of the premises does 79 we should be more-or-less uncritically committing to maintaining an
80 not extend beyond Meeting for Worship on a Sunday.</p> 80 old building which will likely continue to require substantial
81 <p>One view of the balance sheet is that we are running at a 20K/annum 81 investment. This eventually led to a presentation to AM in August.
82 deficit. Some members clearly see this as an acceptable cost, others think at 82 In the twenty years since we purchased 7VT, no overall review of
83 the very least the AM needs to explicitly acknowledge this.</p> 83 our use of the premises has been undertaken.</p>
84 <p>The possibility of moving towards 7VT as the Scottish equivalent of 84 <p>Our circumstances have changed in many ways over that time,
85 Friends House has been raised, and deserves to be re-considered, without losing 85 including changes in external regulation: Child Protection, Health
86 sight of the history of our previous, failed, attempt to do so.</p> 86 and Safety, Food Sanitation. The rental of our premises has also
87 <p>Trustees have initiated their own review, and put a hold on all capital 87 evolved, alongside an increase in the number of other churches etc.
88 expenditure until this group has reported.</p> 88 who make premises available. The issue of balance between income
89 <p>Some of these issues interact with aspects of the role of the paid 89 generated and operating costs, given our commitment to charging
90 meetinghouse staff.</p> 90 very low rents for Quaker groups/other groups with certain
91 <p>One way of looking at the financial side is to see the deficit as the 91 specified qualities.</p>
92 rent that AM pays for the use we get from the building.</p> 92 <p>At the same time, the awareness of many Quaker users of the
93 <p>Phil Lucas recalled that on his and Pat's arrival as Wardens in 1994, the 93 premises does not extend beyond Meeting for Worship on a
94 building was running at a loss, but they were given the explicit goal of making 94 Sunday.</p>
95 the building pay for itself. He believes that the revenue account balanced 95 <p>One view of the balance sheet is that we are running at a
96 from around 1997. It's the capital expenditures which provoke the deficit</p> 96 20K/annum deficit. Some members clearly see this as an acceptable
97 <p>Henry Thompson summarised that we have to both get clear what the actual 97 cost, others think at the very least the AM needs to explicitly
98 numbers are, and then decide how we are going to <i>treat</i> those 98 acknowledge this.</p>
99 numbers, and that we have a lot of choices in how we arrive at a summary to 99 <p>The possibility of moving towards 7VT as the Scottish equivalent
100 underpin our search for a vision. Rufus Read suggested that a cash flow 100 of Friends House has been raised, and deserves to be re-considered,
101 forecast would be a tool to help in this regard.</p> 101 without losing sight of the history of our previous, failed,
102 <p>Henry Thompson and others attempted to recall the reasons we sold Stafford 102 attempt to do so.</p>
103 Street and bought 7 Victoria Terrace:</p> 103 <p>Trustees have initiated their own review, and put a hold on all
104 <ul> 104 capital expenditure until this group has reported.</p>
105 <li>Meeting room itself was an awkward L-shaped space, on first floor, 105 <p>Some of these issues interact with aspects of the role of the
106 up a narrow staircase—some elderly/infirm friends had stopped attending;</li> 106 paid meetinghouse staff.</p>
107 <li>Need for larger/better children and teenagers space;</li> 107 <p>One way of looking at the financial side is to see the deficit
108 <li>Desire 108 as the rent that AM pays for the use we get from the building.</p>
109 to share facilities with other groups</li> 109 <p>Phil Lucas recalled that on his and Pat's arrival as Wardens in
110 <li>We explored non-central locations, came 110 1994, the building was running at a loss, but they were given the
111 to view a central location as not only an equal tax on everyone in terms of 111 explicit goal of making the building pay for itself. He believes
112 transport, but also a value in itself as an opportunity for witness.</li> 112 that the revenue account balanced from around 1997. It's the
113 </ul> 113 capital expenditures which provoke the deficit</p>
114 </div> 114 <p>Henry Thompson summarised that we have to both get clear what
115 <div> 115 the actual numbers are, and then decide how we are going to
116 <h2>4. Topics for next meeting</h2> 116 <i>treat</i>those numbers, and that we have a lot of choices in how
117 <ul> 117 we arrive at a summary to underpin our search for a vision. Rufus
118 <li>Questions we might ask;</li> 118 Read suggested that a cash flow forecast would be a tool to help in
119 <li>Whom we might ask, and who will take responsibility for getting 119 this regard.</p>
120 <p>Henry Thompson and others attempted to recall the reasons we
121 sold Stafford Street and bought 7 Victoria Terrace:</p>
122 <ul>
123 <li>Meeting room itself was an awkward L-shaped space, on first
124 floor, up a narrow staircase—some elderly/infirm friends had
125 stopped attending;</li>
126 <li>Need for larger/better children and teenagers space;</li>
127 <li>Desire to share facilities with other groups</li>
128 <li>We explored non-central locations, came to view a central
129 location as not only an equal tax on everyone in terms of
130 transport, but also a value in itself as an opportunity for
131 witness.</li>
132 </ul>
133 </div>
134 <div>
135 <h2>4. Topics for next meeting</h2>
136 <ul>
137 <li>Questions we might ask;</li>
138 <li>Whom we might ask, and who will take responsibility for getting
120 answers from them;</li> 139 answers from them;</li>
121 <li>What examples might we look at;</li> 140 <li>What examples might we look at;</li>
122 <li>Getting a cashflow forecast and a cashflow history</li> 141 <li>Getting a cashflow forecast and a cashflow history</li>
123 </ul> 142 </ul>
124 </div> 143 </div>
125 <div> 144 <div>
126 <h2>5. Next Meeting</h2> 145 <h2>5. Next Meeting</h2>
127 <p>Our next meeting will be at 7:30 p.m. on Tuesday 13th January at 7 146 <p>Our next meeting will be at 7:30 p.m. on Tuesday 13th January at
128 Victoria Terrace.</p> 147 7 Victoria Terrace.</p>
129 </div> 148 </div>
130 149 </body>
131 </body></html> 150 </html>